Paul Chek: Exploring Consciousness & Stalking The Wild Pendulum



hi I'm guy Lawrence and you were listening to the gallows podcast if you're enjoying this content and you want to find out more and join me and come further down the rabbit hole make sure you head back to the guy Lawrence calm by you awesome guys enjoy the show Paul welcome to the podcast it's my pleasure thank you very much for having me I have to ask you this and I'm dying to know the answer you travel a lot probably you're on an airplane yeah I got burned out doing that well if you were on an airplane and a stranger sat next to you and ask you what you did for a living what would you say it's happened many times I tell them I'm a holistic health practitioner easy and then depending on whether we're there actor probably start poking questions in in all sorts of different directions usually what is that is the next question yeah fair enough now I'm here today and I've been I've been itching to I've been looking at your blog I've been researching a lot of the content you put out there and and it blows my mind honestly Paul that's the depth of knowledge that you have and where you go with this with this work and it just seems to get deeper and deeper and deeper and and the more alone myself it just asks more questions and it just keeps going and it's quite incredible so so thank you the stuff I share with the public's just the tip of the iceberg you know it takes about seven years to complete my training and when you get to you know courses like check level four where we do a very deep dive into the psyche or check level three where we do the entire totem pole and I show how the control systems of the body work and why you have to assess the body in a very specific order you'll always be trait chasing symptoms it's far far deeper unfortunately for me it's kind of a double-edged sword because many business analysts have looked at my work and said you give so much away people actually think they know what you really do by just watching videos and stuff like that but it it's deceptive because what you actually teach far deeper than that but you know I feel a social obligation it's kind of my way of doing community work to share the things that I feel at least if I give the stuff I give that people have a chance of getting healthy because there's so damn much misinformation out there and just lousy information and so many pseudo experts yeah I just it's kind of my way of putting birdseed in the bird feeder you know and I figure the right people will find it because people won't do anything to heal until they're ready so you know like many many people have said jeez why don't you have a lot more viewers than this you know you should have so much more views with the quality of this material and often tell them money because my works not fluffy you know take a pill beat do magic it's you really have to participate so I'm glad you enjoy it and like I was saying it's far deeper than that I'm really only just putting sound bites out there ya know I guess I can relate mate I can relate and I wanted to mention earlier on because you were my wife's podcast a couple I think was a couple of months back Linda great bridge love and guts you mentioned a book and I've got it here Stoke in the wild pendulum by it's like been tough is that probably the and and you recommend it on the show and when I heard the interviewers like I've gotta check that out and and it's amazing it's absolutely amazing book and it's on the mechanics of consciousness which is yes a topic that fascinates me and the question I have for you I guess is is being a holistic health practitioner like you know that's the broad umbrella term for for many things but where did it start for you to start actually looking at this kind of work was consciousness was it wasn't a shift or a specific event or something or did it just come naturally Roger well my mother became a yogi she was a Christian Scientist but then she joined the self-realization fellowship when I was 12 so when I started going to the sunday meetings they were all run by the monks and they were you know meditation was part of every service they taught us meditation and the monks unlike going to a Christian Science church or any Christian Church I've experienced or know anybody that I know of that's gone they can't get their questions answered and if they do it's almost always something to do with hell and damnation and fear and what God wants or expects from you but it never gets into any depth of you know good explanations it's mostly just dogma but so by the time I was 12 I had a lot of questions you know questions like how could God love you but burn you in hell for touching your genitals or making a mistake and how could how could it be that you have to take Jesus as your Savior or you'll burn in hell and there's billions of people that don't even know who Jesus is and things like that so when I started having access to monks and I could ask questions I got great answers and then through my childhood meditation experiences I found myself one having visions which was quite wild for him I mean I would have visions and it would feel for example like I was in another place or you know maybe another dimension of reality like a waking dream but it was as real as when I was awake kind of you know with my eyes open walking around and so then when I was 15 I went to summer camp with the monks so I got to spend a lot more time with him and learning more techniques and asking more questions and then as I was doing my research and development and seeing the science out there and and you don't various scientists discussing what consciousness was a lot of the things they were saying didn't match the experiences that I was already having and when I was 12 due to a tremendous amount of stress in my life I started having very profound out-of-body experiences and at first it scared the hell out of me I thought there was something wrong with me but then I realized well if if this can happen maybe if I just stay focused and try to work with it I could learn to control it and with with within a couple of weeks I was able to actually leave my body and go all over the place on the farm and I thought well I have to figure out if I'm actually hallucinating or if this is real so I started we had a hundred and forty acre farm and you know a big woollen factory and so there's tools all over the place and because a lot of wild dogs and animals would come attack our sheep we had loaded weapons in pretty much every corner of every building so that we could kill whatever was trying to kill the Sheep so I would leave my body and I would go look around on the farm see what I could identify then in the morning when I went to do my chores I'd go see if it was actually there and I proved to myself over and over again I'm actually somehow able to leave my body and carry my consciousness anywhere and later I learned that that was called remote viewing and so in 2000 I believe it was 2000 2001 I I went to the field conference put on by Lynne McTaggart and there was a remote viewing training course there run by the director of the CIA's remote viewing program and I just felt very like I intuitively sensed I needed to go there because I already had the sense that I could Remote View long story made short they had a contest at the end there was 750 people there in this class and at the end they had a contest and I won the contest and it really freaked out two of my instructors because they'd been training with me for years and didn't know I had these abilities and so through all my research and dealing with people's problems and you know head traumas and from a medical perspective I I wanted to look into you know what is post-traumatic stress disorder what causes brain injuries what happens to the brain and I kept seeing you know piles of information suggesting that consciousness was created by the brain but I always had this question well if that's true how is it that I can actually leave my body and go anywhere I want to go if I want to go to the moon I can get there as quick as I can focus on it and be there if I want to go to the Sun I can do it and I spent years traveling all over to the moon to the Sun and many dimensions my soul would take me to these other dimensions and I would work with people there so I found that the so-called scientific materialistic view of consciousness was was very I just have to say wrong it's kind of like somebody that's never had sex writing a bunch of books about sex and typical int'l intellectual silliness you know Young says intellectualism is a common cover-up for fear of direct experience and I found that to be just exceedingly true so I just kept because it was so because consciousness is so foundational and so pivotal to human life I researched and researched and one book would lead me to others or one expert would lead me to others and I studied research into sigh and and you know watched mountains of geoffery myth mish lugs thinking aloud shows where cuz he's a PhD and entire research and I have literally hundreds and hundreds of books on everything to do with the soul with God I mean I've probably got four or five thousand I've got a house full of books a whole library before I moved here I had an 1,800 square-foot library of nothing but book shows all catalog that was my research library so between being able to access the monks and then you know the other thing is is it's one thing to hear it from a monk but then I have to say well I can't just say I learned that from a monk people won't believe me so then I would go look into this stuff and as everything you find people diametrically opposed well you come across a guy like it's AG ben taub when I first came across that book many years ago I mean I don't know how long ago that I read that but probably in the you know maybe 95 96 or something like that I went now this is the real deal here's a scientist who's also a very advanced meditator and a remote viewer in fact it's that Ben tov had a friend that worked for NASA and this is before they knew what the rings of Saturn were made of and so his friend had told them they were trying to figure it out and he said I I can tell you what they are because I've been there he said it's it's rocks and chunks of debris that have collected in the orbital field of the planet and the guy went back and told people at NASA and they kind of just laughed at him but when the first space probe came back with pictures it was exactly what Ben Tov had told them so hmm it was through these experiences I just kept going deeper and deeper and then I was always interested how does the research correlate to what I experienced and so I was always kind of looking what is the research saying what do I experience and if I found different ideas in the research then it gave me a way to go inside and see what I could figure out so you know sorry for the long winded answer but that's how it's insane it's incredibly powerful a couple of people sprung to mind cuz i've had linda my target on my show oh actually oh yeah yeah she's just an amazing woman and i found dr. eben Alexander yes I've listened to some interviews with him I've I think I have his book somewhere but I might have listened to his book on audio it's been a while but yeah I know who he is and I know his story and I studied extensive stuff with Ray Moody and and many many many books and documentaries on life after death and carnation research and as you know reincarnation is fairly traditional in the Eastern philosophy and the monks talk about that quite extensively and that's another topic there's a lot of confusion on in religions even Buddhism is confused about that this man when you I'm so what like when you have experiences like that and like you say nobody can take those experiences away from you once you once they're real to you they're real you know yeah well what do you think that does for you in terms of living life on earth you know because it must affect the way you make decisions and the way you go about things and fear must evaporation in a lot of areas that we can live with yeah well you know I'm in 2006 I did a year of training with a physician that used that uses psychedelics as part of his healing therapy for people and so prior to that I had also worked with a master of Tai Chi and Qi Gong so I took my meditation training from self-realization fellowship and I'd already you know as soon as I learned I can Remote View automatically it told me well look I'm able to go places look at things walk deep you know my consciousness is there my sense of my body is there but I'm in a light body for example if I look at my hand it's made of light it's not native of physical stuff so I had already from an early age begin meditating on this and realized there's no way that I can go do these things if I'm only my body so the first thing that that happened to me as I realize death is not death of consciousness death is not death of the sense of self death is merely the loss of your physical body and I've studied Rudolf Steiners work extensively I've got about a hundred and seventy of his books written either by him or initiative Steiner and Steiners got extensive teachings on what happens when you die and just like the Buddhists do and other traditions but I basically realize that most of the people that had all these opinions about what happens when you die we're very undeveloped and they were just usually cut and pasting other people's opinions so they're just you know programmed robots but what it did for me is it took away a lot of the kind of background unconscious stress I think you know art there's the two main fears people have based on research is public speaking and dying yeah so the two things people are the most frayed I was having to speak in public and died I was never afraid to speak in public I've always had that in me but I also had some profound God experiences when I was a child that helped me realize that what God was was not what people thought God was and due to my meditations on God and and through my soul it became very clear to me that if God can't die then nothing can die because God is the prime source from which all emerges and you know the first principle of Sufism is there is no god but god I worship everything in everyone so if everything is God then basically everything's just in some form of energy and information expressing itself and even physics says energy cannot be destroyed only transformed so really what happened to me at a core level as I realized I'm here as an agent of consciousness so that God can experience itself in this unique way that I call myself and just like who guy is is another novel expression of the divine experiencing itself and life through that unique perspective and I came to the realization that every living creature on earth or in the universe is like a neuron in the mind of the universe which is the mind and body of God and and when you come to that authentic realization not intellectual yeah then you realize that one what we call life is an eternal process and that there it takes up the background fear away I mean when you really if you could really measure how much of people's beliefs and behaviors are oriented around trying to avoid anything that could potentially kill them it's a huge huge amount of people's unconscious stresses or conscious stressors especially as they age so it left me in a position of feeling much more at ease in myself and much more willing to truly express myself and you know live fully through whatever I was doing racing stock cars racing motorcycles you know I was a paratrooper in the 82nd Airborne Division which is certainly a dangerous hobby you know I've I've been face to face with death many times and so I think what it did is it just it left me in a place of feeling I am here to live fully and when I'm done living fully I will have no problem with dying because the problem for most people is they haven't lived when it's time to die it's you know so I live in this sense of knowing that my experiences are God's experiences when I use God I'm not talking about some old men in the sky I'm talking about consciousness itself not consciousness like my consciousness or your consciousness and that's where consciousness research is completely backwards that's conscious of you are conscious of me and I am conscious of you right now because we're in a relationship but it's consciousness itself that allows us to have a carrier for the wave forms of energy and information that we interpret as conscious of so death is really merging back into the ocean of consciousness in fact Rumi says you are not a drop of the ocean you are the ocean in a drop says it all we screw the scientific researchers just go read Rumi and you're okay it's incredible I often think and I'm a nerve ending sending information back exactly the trailer on yeah right the nerve ending has to have a neuron attached to it or what how can it communicate right exactly all living things from single-celled organisms are to human beings to whales and dolphins and whatever there is are actually neurons and what you find out through these deep experiences in its act been Tom's book give you plenty of reason to realize that all of his books is even in the afterlife I've worked with many people in the afterlife I've been helping people with crisis of that this type of that type and one of their loved ones comes to say tell them not to worry or it gives me information I could never know and it freaks them right out because there's no way I could know the things and so what what you realize is that you know photons which scientifically haven't almost pretty much an infinite capacity to carry information are also neurons and really what are we we're just a bundle of light entangled that's what equals mc-squared basically tells us and and you know you're an atom is 99.999 to the like six decimal point empty so really we're just light spinning around an invisible center called the zero point which if he's studying a cement Harriman's work each atom has a black hole in the center of it yeah you know if you study the physics of love you know you'll without going through a long expose basically God is dreaming itself into existence and the dream is so real we can't tell the difference and the beautiful you know if you look at us from a sort of a Taoist respect perspective chang-su said if men can dream is a butterfly what makes you think a butterfly can't dream he's a man well that kind of sums it right up you know you and I keep thinking about from my own experience because once you have experiences like I've had some experiences Paul that nobody can take that away from me they changed the game for me yeah it changes the game as simple as that and and then once that happens it I could I could then start to feel almost empathy and compassion for other people that are in a place that I haven't got this I guess connection or this in yeah that I believe is almost like a gift and you've worked with so many people so many yeah what have you found because people could be listening to this today going what the hell are these guys talking about or where is this at or like what have you found has it helped lead people into this work more do they have to want to do it is it a curiosity or is it pain or is it a bit of bit of everything to people well you know I can answer that question for you lots of ways but if you look at the history of evolution on earth well there was a time when there was nothing here but water and minerals right yeah in the beginning and from there somehow the energy and information there the energy and the information progressively made itself more and more complex and so you have single-celled organisms that move away from threats and move toward food or pleasure as a basic drive for survival and then you see around the time that jellyfish emerge that was the first time we saw nervous systems emerging in nature which I don't know what you know how many million years ago that was 200 million years ago or more I can't remember the exact details but then you see as the creatures in nature got more and more complex and developed more and more complex nervous systems they were able to perceive an expiry more and more and so human beings if you look at the if you look at a book on embryology you can actually see their stages in the in the development of the neonate in the womb where it looks identical to a seahorse and then it looks like denticles to a chicken it looks identical so you actually can see in utero that we're recapitulating all these stages of development that happened on earth and so the model of development stays in the human genome and we just keep building more and more complex creatures and so how that relates to what you're talking about is that people develop psychically from we started off with minerals and water so they start off at a very very materialistic level of consciousness with what they can see and what they can touch and weigh and measure so you have your kind of scientific materialists mindset but you know so they you look at scientists for example that say consciousness isn't necessary to figure out mathematical equations on what consciousness is in other words they're saying it's only information it's not actually something substantial but as Nasim Harriman says they forget that they are the consciousness involved in the equation in quantum physics shows you that you can't go into any kind of scientific research with any bias about what you want the double-slit experiment showed you if you're looking for particles you get them if you're looking for waves you get waves and that you cannot separate the observer from the experiment so what I'm sharing here is that we just as our bodies came out of a mineral and water Malu and progressively got more complex to the point that we had self reflection we also are in a cultural meilu where we're enculturated into belief systems and until those belief systems create enough confusion and pain for us to say way I have to look deeper into this because believing what everybody tells me isn't setting me free it's not making me feel connected and pain you know pain is an absolutely necessary necessary force because if we didn't have pain we would just stay unconscious I'm sure you've hurt yourself before doing something and you had to figure out how to get better and so you know someone hurts their back well all of sudden now they find out well there's five lumbar vertebra there's this thing called a sacrum and you got discs between them and dot dot dot and all of a sudden now they're more conscious than they ever were about what a lumbar spine is and so they start doing the exercises and inevitably sometimes they don't work and so then a woman says jeez you know I'm doing all these exercises and it's not working so she goes to see a therapist or a check professional and they say well you've also got the symptoms of a bladder infection do you have burning with urination yes I do have you ever noticed that when you're premenstrual you have low back pain yes I do quite frequently in fact my back hurts a lot worse what I'm treatments well that's because your uterus shares a neurological association with your low back region and your pelvic girdle so then all the sudden they're more conscious that their back is not just their back it's actually linked into the organs that share a sympathetic nerve supply so then you start looking into people like I've worked with many patients that have had a hysterectomy but they still have exactly the same symptoms and same pains but their uterus is gone the doctor says it's all in your head and I tell them you have an energy field that Tibetan monks figured this out 900 years ago that the energy field formed very quickly within a very short period of time after the sperm met the egg and the entire energy field of the body and all the acupuncture meridians were in place and that guided the division of the cells so that the stem cells knew what to become so all I'm showing you is that just the same way that pain can give us a to keep asking bigger questions and looking and looking if you keep going them you realize well as long as you believe you're in pain you'll be in pain and lo and behold the placebo shows you just the placebo research shows you just that so the next thing you know we'll God my mind can actually make my body hurt it can make my posture change my facial expression pain change it can change my attitude attitude determines altitude so then you have to start saying well what the hell is the mind and then you get all sorts of confusing conflicting answers and so what do you find out well if you look at dr. Siegel's work mind is an embodied and relational process that regulates the flow of energy and information so you find out that mind is actually a field of information well so what happens is everything links back to consciousness because what is consciousness well it's AG bent us as consciousness is the total information carrying capacity of any system well what's the largest system God the universe the multiverse whatever it is something's creating all this stuff and it's created in a field of action and then you find i'm Stein who said the field is the sole governing agency of the particle what is a field by scientific definition it's a place of action so you know without going deeper and deeper do you see that you if you start just paying attention you'll see that people start off at the level of their social programming but the programming by nature always brings them to situations where the socially contrived answers do not bring freedom or alleviation of pain and so they have to dig deeper and every time they honestly go on their own hero's journey and instead of listening to everybody with white jackets and PhDs and MDS take responsibility for looking themselves they end up in mysticism and if you go deep enough into science they say look John Archer Archibald wheeler one of the most famous quantum physicists that ever lived made a very profound statement one time and I've got it in one of my books with him in it he said any day now at the end of one of my mathematical equations I expect to find a Rishi sitting there well a Rishi is a wise man or a sage and what he meant was I keep finding in scientific investigations the exact same answers that the Lao tzus the Chiang sues the Buddha's etc gave us so really we're trying to use an objective tool to measure that which is subjective and even the person doing the measuring seems to overlook the fact that yes two plus two equals four but what's looking at it and counting cannot be counted this is why Einstein said not everything that counts can be counted and not everything that can be counted counts yeah okay yeah and like it all tracks back to the same thing doesn't it like you say no matter what breadcrumbs you follow it all leads back to source well it all leads back to who's looking because thoughts still is a flow of energy and information so thought itself is energy and information and this is why I said consciousness of if you're conscious of the thoughts you're having or the words you want to say to me you're only conscious of the flow of energy and information so the way I describe this to people is think of consciousness like a dance floor the dance floor doesn't do a damn thing but it knows about every single foot that's touching it it knows everything about the dance because it's all emergent from the dance floor because the dance floor isn't doing anything but creating a backdrop upon which movement or the flow of energy and information can be perceived the flow of energy and form a is what we call mind but what it's flowing from and to is consciousness in caps so mathematically consciousness is a zero everything else is a one or a combination of zeros and ones zero is the vertical dimension one is the horizontal dimension of past present and future but when you're in a deep meditative state or when I'm doing remote viewing I go out of the one dimension of horizontal into the vertical dimension which means I enter into the field out of which all possibilities emerge and a shaman is someone who knows how to climb the ladder of the strata of consciousness because those things all enter penetrate the horizontal dimension and that's one of the meanings of the cross the vertical dimension means the subtle the intangible or the imaginary or a Carl Jung would say your psyche is not imaginary it's imagined though something that we think something that's imaginary isn't real but something that's imaginal means it's imagining as an image or an experience and everything that we do is based on our own inner perception and there's nothing more real than your inner perception which is why people have wet dreams they have dreams that are so real that they orgasm they can have dreams that are so scary they actually can't tell the difference between whether they're alive and the dream or they're alive here which is exactly why Chang soo said man if a butterfly if I'm if man can dream he's a butterfly what think you what it makes you think a butterfly can't dream he's a man because when you're in the imaginal realm nothing is more or less real than anything else so ultimately if you take a dot and put it in the center of an equidistant cross the dot represents the zero point everything on the vertical axis is imaginal or is the possibilities that are accessible in the field of mind and when there's enough energy and focus it becomes tangible in the physical realm for example of somebody if you look at psychoneuroimmunology there's mountains of research showing if someone keeps thinking that they have a broken heart they're likely to manifest a heart disease if you keep saying so-and-so's a pain in the ass you're likely to manifest a rectal cancer because we actually take energy and information and put it into formation we take the subtle imaginal and we build cells around it so our tumors and our gut problems are often the physical manifestations of our dominant thoughts feelings emotions and beliefs which is huge well that's what that's all there is I got I got ask god there's so many directions I could take this right now I'm processing everything you say as well Paul you mentioned shaman and I saw a shaman about eight years ago did an ayahuasca ceremony and and I was I prepared for it well I spent a lot of time researching and understanding and actually and I felt I learned just about as much about myself before I did the ceremony than actually having the ceremony itself which was quite incredible but I think that was like a catalyst for me though to start open me opening me up in different ways to start then really start to have a deeper understanding of this work and again it helped me move towards navigating what I needed to look for because I've had an experience so then I was trying to find things that that could reaffirm my experience that I had which I think is what you spoke about at the beginning yes that's exactly what happens with or without the drug I mean meditation can do that to you trauma can do that to you I've been knocked I've been in a coma for two days in a motorcycle racing act so you know there's a lot of ways we can get into those experiences but psychedelic medicines just they basically break down the egos filtration system so we are exposed to the flow of energy and information and you've got you know physiology says we have about 9 billion bits of information flowing through our sensory system per second but the ego selects between 10 and 100 that are based on its percent of what it needs to survive so our sensory systems are actually flowing at a rate of nine billion bits of information a second of typewritten pages about a thousand bits so you have an encyclopedia britannica flowing through you every second but the ego only selects out ten to 100 or about half a paragraph every second which you then focus on in your conscious ego-driven reality and research shows the egos only about five to seven percent of our total consciousness and that's what we think is reality but the ego really should be called the unconscious because what we call unconscious is what's regulating thirty billion billion biochemical reactions a second digesting eliminating metabolizing keeping us breathing keeping our heart beating so we've kind of got our we're like here we're upside down in our thinking right and what do you do when you take a psychedelic medicine like ayahuasca the filtration system breaks down and you go down inside the flow of consciousness and all of a sudden you find there is a hell of a lot there it's the I didn't even know existed but within myself and that was the thing you you you you carry this all your life unconsciously yes and then you start waking up well that's what it felt like right that's the answer to your question why do people have such a hard time with all this stuff because they haven't woken up yet why I'll tell you why two reasons why one any true spiritual practice is a threat to the ego the ego is a control freak and any legitimate spiritual practice is a disillusion it's a dissolving of the ego so the ego thinks it's dying so it resists all legitimate spiritual growth practices you have to have real balls to dissolve that ego because you have to be willing to give up your illusion of control so people are afraid to lose control because they think that loss of control automatically means something Bad's going to happen they forget just as much good can happen as bad so there's there's that issue I forgot what was the the question there the question was about waking up and you said people yeah so I forgot what my second one I was going to share with you is but you know the first thing that I really wanted to point out was that the the ego resists control oh the second one is the other one that's very profound and real and as a therapist who studied this extensively because I've been doing this for 35 years and helped countless thousands of people with serious health problems consciousness comes at quite a price and Steiner took talked about this quite extensively most diseases are the byproduct of consciousness you see if you didn't know that your company was shutting down and you were gonna be without a job you wouldn't be worried about losing your job and you wouldn't be scared that you're not might not have a pension so if if you get wind from maybe one of your buddies who works in the accounting department and says you know I'm not supposed to tell anybody this but this company is going to be shutting down in six months and you've been working there for 20 years and you start telling yourself oh my god what else am I gonna do I don't have any other skills you know so you go into this self driven fear and the next thing you know you've got a stomach ulcer you can't digest your sex drives gone so really what I'm sharing is when we're conscious of things two things happen one the rest of our programming acts on our belief systems about what that means and oftentimes because the negative bias built into our mind because in nature we had to focus on the things that might kill us so the brain is actually wired to look for threats because in our developmental time in nature you couldn't ignore a tiger or a poisonous snake dot dot dot so now what happens when we become conscious of things our negative bias always looks for the threat and to the degree that we believe that it's true without really knowing if it's true or not we project that negative bias into the future and all of a sudden we are now manifesting anxiety high blood pressure fear digestive trouble so when I look at what's causing people all their health problems it's almost always a belief about something and most of those beliefs are about things that haven't happened yet like my husband's cheating on me I know he is do you have any physical evidence of that no but I just know he is I'm gonna lose my job or I might die and the list is long right people worry because they're too immature to actually investigate things you know and then it's one out and then the next question I'm sure for many people would be how do you then handle that once some once you've become consciously aware of a situation that's probably you can start generating fear with young and then and then worry and then the next thing you know you ruminating over these things day in day out week in week out it's like then how do you interject and break that cycle for people initially as well I developed a system because that's really what I have to teach people to help them heal pretty much all aside from you know falling off your bicycle or falling off a ladder or getting hit in a car accident look if you look at the research 85% of all orthopedic disorders reported to doctors orthopedic surgeons and general practitioners are idiopathic which means the patient has no knowledge of how the pain got started that's eighty five out of every 100 people coming for help with some kind of back neck body pain does not know how it got started will it get started by unconscious choices unconscious behaviors not knowing how to lift properly over exercising unders exercising eating incorrectly dot-dot-dot so the point I'm making is in order to help people heal I had to give them a tool they could use to learn how to reprogram themselves or they just keep using the same beliefs that cause the problem so you now you're just in palliative care which didn't interest me at all any idiot can do that to really help people heal you got to get way past ultrasounding and pills and cutting out you have to go into what's really causing it so I developed a four step process step one is what is your dream what do you love enough to change for I tell people if you have a big enough dream you don't need a crisis so first you have to identify what is it that I love enough to change for so for example someone i trackback a person's digestive trouble to fear that they're going to lose their job and I say okay what is your dream and they might say well my dream is to have financial abundance I say great does then I say okay that's your dream your fear is that I'm gonna lose my job so I call it the coin drill I created something very simple and I actually have special coins that I had made up with a Tai Chi symbol on one side a Z and the other side is Yang and I say okay that thought is that a negative or a positive relative to your dream and everyone knows it's a negative I say well if the negative exists the positive must also exist north can't exist without South in can't exist without out up can't exist without down so now that you know that you are having this fear of losing your job what must also exist as an equal possibility flip the coin over and they could say well I'm not going to lose my job that's a positive and then I look at them and say is that true they say well I don't know so I say well if you don't know and you can't buy into it fully then go to the middle of the coin because the middle is not negative or positive it represents potential so then you say I have the potential to lose my job good so I say well what is it that you can say that's positive with regard to your dream of having abundance in your life and not having to worry about money and then you they might say well I have the potential to get another job or I I'm I can get another job very good how do you feel when you think the thought I can get another job good I said well how do you feel when you think the thought not only can I get another job but I might be able to get a better job with more money and a better insurance policy oh I feel fantastic I said well there you go if you're going to invest your energy into a thought and research shows the instant you start thinking a thought that's emotionally charged they actually now have fMRI images of the brain immediately developing neural networks to support that belief and when the more emotion and there is the faster the neural network forms and the more efficient it become so that's what I call introducing them to the pain teacher I said the pain teacher comes to show you where you have a mind virus so when you think the thought oh my god I'm gonna lose my job you say thank you dear pain teacher for showing me where I have a mind virus my dream is to have abundance and prosperity you flip the coin I have the potential to get even a better job and I'm excited because if I lose my job I'm just gonna go trust the universe to guide me to the next company I'm supposed to work with to be with people I can enjoy being around that share my values and my life will even be better and so when they start embodying that lo and behold that's exactly what happens brilliant and then they've the first step that is actually being consciously aware though that that's going on and then they take the moment and then they intervene well you know oftenly they're often they're not consciously aware they often come to me with their problems but they don't think that has anything to do with that they think I just have a digestive trouble or my neck hurts or whatever so then I showed them how the chakra system works and I say thoughts about losing your job have to do with safety and security that's the root chakra so we look at issues of safety and curity you know your stomach is in the third chakra which is the zone of who am i and how do I use my personal power and self-will so I say look you're using your personal power and self-will to manifest what you don't want and your your mind is God to your body so whatever you think your body believes is real so if what your thoughts are telling you is that you're afraid your body reacts as though it's afraid but the physiological systems are not designed to be in a fight-or-flight state for long periods of time because it will literally burn the body out there's no time in nature that we were running for a lion from a lion for a year straight Lions can't run that long so what I do is use maps and models so they can see and you know I do things like muscle testing I say I can prove it to you hold your arm out resist me and they resist they say okay that's what I call a baseline now I want you to think the thought I'm weak and resist me as hard as you can and boom they're weak as cheese I don't care I've done this with some strong men with deltoids the size of volleyballs and I can push them down with one finger and then I say now I want you to hold the thought that you are abundant you are prosperous you were safe and I can't I can swing off their arm even off a little women I can't push it down I'd have to flip their whole body over then I show them another technique I say okay let's just do a baseline muscle test empty your head resist me that's how strong you are okay good now what I want you to do is tell me your name and your age and then ask the question is this true so I would say I'm Paul check I'm 57 years old is it true I would test strong and I say now with it as much conviction as you can muster tell me your name and your age but lie tell me that you're your mother's name I'm Margaret Jane Spa and I'm 76 years old and try to believe it as hard as you can't and they go weak as hell no matter hard why because telling a lie in nature always increases the likelihood that you're gonna die because anytime you lie to somebody about where food is that or where threats are at it increases the risk of all of you dying and we couldn't survive without each other in nature so our nervous systems will not support a lie and the more we lie to ourselves consciously or unconsciously the more fear we get in ourselves and the more we manifest fear reactions and our physiology is fear-based which means our adrenaline levels are high or cortisol levels are high our blood sugar management gets all screwed up you know we have three primary hormones we have to have to survive insulin adrenaline and cortisol and how you use your mind and the choices you make regulate those three hormones and if you burn your adrenal glands out you set yourself up for a lot of chronic problems and if you don't manage your blood sugar you screw yourself off up so to finish the four-step model 1 what is my dream 2 what are the two polarities three there's three choices you can make in relation to any person place or thing the optimal which is the one that's best for you and everybody involved the suboptimal gives you instant gratification but usually causes problems on your dream team for example the person who thinks I'm going to lose my job how the fear says I'm going to go to the casino and I'm gonna gamble my $10,000 in my savings account and hopefully I'll win a hundred thousand and I won't have to worry and so they lose their money and then they have to go home and tell their spouse I don't have any we don't have any money left I was so afraid to lose my job I gambled it trying to you know get rich quick so the suboptimal always gives instant gratification in some way but causes problems for everybody that's most important to the issue at hand three is do nothing do nothing has a few options one call a timeout if you're in a heated discussion and you're not able to stay connected to the person you're talking to because it's breaking down and it's going to get worse to do nothing means don't make a choice until you have enough information to make a well informed so someone's trying to sell you on a new job because you're afraid you're gonna lose your job but they're offering you half the salary that you were getting and you still don't have objective evidence the company's going to shut down anyhow remember it was an inside leak and in the we don't know that's true we got six months left anything could happen so you need to gather information don't buy the car metaphorically till you're sure it's the best deal in town three is empathy I mean is apathy and apathy is the isn't is actually the functional opposite of love if you if you research shows that to hate somebody is still a higher form of connection than to be apathetic which means to not care so children raised by apathetic parents have a higher rate of disease and criminality than parents who abuse their kids because at least if you're abusing someone you're showing them attention enough to hit them or to talk to them so if the worst choice we can make is to be apathetic and today we have a lot of apathetic people so what is your dream what are the two polarities that you're working with with your mind what choices are you willing to make and then you have four doctors doctor happiness is the effective use of your mind doctor diet is the effective use of diet doctor quiet is the effective use of rest and doctor movement is putting your body or your emotions or your mind into effective movement so it's dream affirmative so I use that four-step process to teach people how to reprogram themselves and then how to make choices about what is happy making for you that you're willing to do how do you need to move your body your emotions or your mind so it's dream affirmative what do you need to feed yourself physically emotionally and mentally to be nourished at all three levels of your being and how do you rest your body your emotions and your minds so that you're not burning yourself out with a bunch of stinking thinking or poor choices so you can be dream affirmative and took me you know probably fifteen maybe fifteen years to do enough research to synthesize a mountainous stuff down to those four steps and I've helped countless people heal from all sorts of stuff just by using that model yeah that's brilliant Paul thank you for sharing that that's really useful um I'm aware of the time and good long as you're good yeah I got about twenty minutes so I don't so a few questions I ask is what's been a low point in your life but is later turned out to be a blessing well the low point in my life was my childhood my father left my mother when I was about three and and took off he was a competitive dancer and he took off with dance partners and he was a drag racer he was a wild guy and and my mother was you know struggling she had three kids by the time she was 18 her father disowned her kicked her out of the house her mother had died two years before that her sister died one year before that so she was totally alone and isolated she ended up marrying a man that was extremely physically emotionally and mentally abusive to me my brother's sisters her she stayed married to him for 24 years he was a very abusive very dangerous man to be with so by the time I was about 12 I just really didn't even want to be alive and that's when I started having these out-of-body experiences it was my soul showing me that there was more to life and to the world than what my twelve-year-old mind can conceive of so I found that I could go into other realities where I could have safety and more joy there and so my childhood was so painful and I found a human being adults so irrational like sitting in a Christian church I'm like none of this makes sense to me how can you tell me that God is love and God's going to burn you in hell in the same sentence and I actually was so scared that if adults were that stupid I was really in trouble and so what happened was as I left home when I was 16 but what I realize is that my father toughened me up for the world and he gave me an incredible worth work ethic without which I've never I would never have been able to do the mountains of work that I've had to do to build an entire Institute in a worldwide organization so it was like spirit put me through boot camp to experience just how tough life can be for people so I could see just how bad the pain can be and how much trauma there can be so I could have empathy and compassion for people that I would later be a therapist for yet I also learned from my father who was a very intelligent man in a very amazing builder and could make almost anything he used to be a special effects man for Universal Studios so he taught me that don't make excuses get the job done but be creative and use your skills and find people to teach you that know more than you and my mother was very very artistic she's a sculptor a craftswoman and has a lot of unique skills so by the time I got into the military I realized that I was a lot fitter and a lot tougher and a lot more creative than most of the people around me and that my painful childhood had actually prepared me to accomplish what I came to this planet to do yeah Wow thank you for sharing that um what does your morning routine look like I usually get up at about five o'clock take a cold shower drive to work usually get here around 6:00 and then I go through a routine where I blow tobacco and herbs and I do a prayer sequence where I give thanks to the to the to the north to the south to Great Spirit in the fire rooms above mother earth down below the spirits of the West spirits of the East I connect and give thanks to all the great sages and saints and gurus that have guided me I blow smoke and my love into all my healing instruments my rattles my drums my tools I blow smoke to david bohm at sack vent of Arthur M Young Rudolph Steiner Carl Jung and all the great teachers and guides that work with me from the higher dimensions I give thanks to jean gebser for his research and consciousness I have a Native American Indian headdress and I and I also blow smoke to Houston Smith for all the love and he left in the world I blow smoke to my headdress and thank all the great Chiefs for their wisdom and for guiding me to help people I blow smoke to my yearly mandala and thank Great Spirit for guiding me each year and each day I blow smoke to my piece of art where I wrote down my formula for consciousness that soul taught me I give thanks I have a Native American family matrix which is a way to organize psychic energy where I have symbolized all the key instructors and employees in my Institute and I open my heart and send them all love and gratitude and thank them for working with me to create abundance and prosperity for each other in the world and I blow smoke to Chief Joseph I blow smoke to the Dalai Lama I blow smoke to mother Teresa Paramahansa Yogananda and then I have three healing dolls from from the Native American tradition one of them is a medicine man the other one is the chief of ceremonies the other one mint its son face who represents the consciousness of the son so I connect to them and blow my energy into those symbols so I'm thanking the universe for giving me the spirit and the consciousness to help others heal and to help myself heal I thank the universe for giving me the guidance that I need to be a good public leader and I give father-son thanks for his consciousness wisdom life love light and warmth and then I do a tarot reading Tero meditation each day as an inner practice and I set my cards up then they go out and do Tai Chi to clear myself and Center myself and after I do Tai Chi I draw my cards and then meditate on the reading and then I start checking my email I was gonna say for there's so much gratitude I hear when you start your day you know and most most people get up and they check their email and they don't yeah you know I've I've been I've been in so many places in my life Rose in so much pain and I've been so close to death so many times and I've I've done about 400 shamanic ceremonies with medicine where I've literally died and gone way beyond what the ego can even conceive of and I've helped many people with very deep traumas and so I I realized that there is a miracle at play in my life the fact that I'm even here after having had so many motorcycle racing accidents stock car racing accidents parachuting accidents it's as though I know Great Spirit wants me to be here because I've I've given Great Spirit a million opportunities to just take me away and put me back in the ocean of emptiness and so I've learned that that gratitude gives me the strength to know that behind every cloud of grey is a silver lining and if I just stick to my heart and acknowledge where I've been loved and being loved I can make it through pretty much anything yeah amazing um last question if you could have been out with anyone mm-hmm I mean you've read so many books you've had so many mentors like it's incredible if you could have a dare not with any of them who would it be do you think and why oh well it's hard because there's a lot of them but you know it's very tricky I think you know there's a lot on that list but I would probably I would probably want to have dinner with Carl um– okay I had an interesting experience one time a buddy of mine in Toronto who's a very successful man for my birthday bought me an astrology reading from a very famous astrologer who does a lot of astrology work for movie stars and famous people and is very kind of recognized for his astrology work and when I showed up to get my reading he looked at me and he said you know your readings almost identical to two very famous people and I said really who are they he said Carl Jung and Madonna and I said that's mind-blowing because I absolutely loved Madonna I'd love to have sex with her and to I've studied Carl Jung for years and I absolutely have tremendous reverence for him so it turns out that our birth charts he showed me and he actually had copies of their birth charts when you laid my chart over theirs they were almost identical and so it seems that the stars work through us and I've studied a lot of Carl Jung's work and I tell you what that's one man who really did the work to not just be an intellectual left brainer he connected both halves of his brain he pioneered art therapy he developed depth psychology he did you know he developed the myers-briggs personality test I mean the guy was just he's so deep it's unbelievable so I don't think he's more evolved than saying it's Act Ben Taub or a Rudolf Steiner but I feel such an affinity with him that I would love to just hug him kiss him and say thank you because you gave me so many tools to help other people live better that I I would actually offer him a foot massage beautiful beautiful and with everything we've covered today is there anything you'd like to leave our listeners to ponder on I think we've done that quite well I think it does very well I would say that the longest journey most people ever have to take is only a foot long and it's from their head to their heart and whenever you're feeling frustrated angry upset confused just ask this question what would love do now and if you answer that honestly you'll always be okay this beautiful place to end it I couldn't agree more Paul if anyone wants to find out more about you your work you've got a podcast as well yes I'm aware well my Institute is ch ek Institute calm and there's loads of stuff there my YouTube channel where I have over 500 videos on a wide variety of topics is youtube.com forward slash Paul CH ek live Paul check live my podcast is living 4d number four capital D with Paul check and there's lots of great interviews on there and my blog is Paul checks blog.com so there's enough to keep people reading and listening and studying for about thirty years there there is there is in this brand I highly recommend anyone listening to go and check it out which I'm sure if they've listened to this podcast all the way through Paul they'll be they'll be hungry for more I don't doubt it well they they've either signed me up on the prayer list so I don't burn in hell or they put me up as a nutcase or they're interested in I've been through all of those so it's okay Paul look thank you so much for your time today and thank you for everything you do and thank you for coming on my show it was truly awesome speaking to you and I'm very grateful thank you I'm very grateful that you took the time and interest to share with me and I that I could share with your listeners and was lovely to share with your wife so thank you welcome thank you Paul

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